Another USA School Shooting

[bozley05]

RED LAKE, Minn. (AP) -- A gunman opened fire at a Minnesota high school Monday, killing eight people, with the suspect believed among those dead, authorities said.

The FBI said eight people died in the mid-afternoon shooting at Red Lake High School in far northern Minnesota.

When will they learn, guns are bad.

[tandoc]

if guns kill people..
pencils spell incorrectly
cars make people drive drunk
and spoons made kirtsy alley fat

god bless you bash.org

[Renegade]

I blame the person their board of education who didn't give them that week off like most schools do for Spring Break.

[niv]

I blame the stereotypical parent that can't develop a child's sense of right and wrong at an early age.

[Wojtek]

i blame cnn

[Toefur]

I blame people that somehow think a parent is responsible for the every single action their offspring perform.

Is every single failure of mine a result of my parents?

[Blank Verse]

I blame the ----ing kids...come on guys, some time people just have to be held accountable for their actions.

[jmiller]

this sounds like the making of a billy tallent video.

[bozley05]

i think the kid blamed his grandparents...

[Blank Verse]

this sounds like the making of a billy tallent video.


my notebook will explain! </crackly whine>

[NC_TOM]

These are high school kids... they know what they're doing and they should have known long ago that killing is wrong... In a lot of other countries people their age are considered adults and dealt with accordingly

[jmiller]

my notebook will explain! </crackly whine>
seriously. angry kids draw pictures of how they'll kill their classmates, not themselves. i don't get that video at all.

[Renegade]

seriously. angry kids draw pictures of how they'll kill their classmates, not themselves. i don't get that video at all.
Yer and that's cool :P

[tandoc]

seriously. angry kids draw pictures of how they'll kill their classmates, not themselves. i don't get that video at all.

i've done that before.. not that i've ever gone and killed ne of my classmates... yet...

[anhedonia]

It's disappointing that this thread has already gone ridiculously off topic, when it is such a serious subject.

Toefur, I agree with you. Parents aren't always responsible for everything. Obviously the blame lies with them some of the time, but just as often, it does not.

[bozley05]

Kids these days are just way too selfish, always thinking about themselves.. i would have though 9/11, Bali, the Tsunami and so on, would of atleast had one positive outcome, opening up the the eyes of people who only think of themselves, let them realise the world is much bigger than one individual.

Like when you see people getting depressed over losing a girlfriend or boyfriend, or getting a bad mark at school that really ----s me. In the whole grand scheme of things, it means nothing. Bring back the cane in schools, and the right for parents to smack kids I say, kids need to learn respect again. And respecting elders too.

[Dean]

I blame Bowling.

[Wojtek]

The problem is both the parents and the kids.

How you raise your kids WILL have an impact on how the behave in the future. We can't deny that.
Let's take two extremes, a crackwh0re's kid and a pastor's kid for example. Raised differently they will behave differently when they grow up.

If you can't raise your kid with at least a minimum set of values, proper behaviour and respect, you failed.


Now for the kids part,
Nowadays they have everything they wine for. Say a 4yr old is in a store with his mommy and starts to cry and wine about some ---- toy he wants. Mommy tells him to be quite, to stop crying, that she wont buy it, but it dosnt work. The kid is getting louder and louder and people start looking at the women with her kid. Not to be embarassed anymore, she gives in and gets the damn toy to make him shut up.

And that's the recipe for spoiled self-centered brats of the 21st century.

Giving a spanking, telling the kid to shut the ---- up and dragging him out fo the store is a big no-no. Hell, some want spanking to be outlawed. Where's the world going?


It's ironic how i said "Now for the kids part" and talked about the mother.
But everything starts fromt he parents.

Sure, you said toefur, you dont blame your parents for your mistakes, but thats because you'v long ago crossed the maturity line.
When does maturity hit nowadays? For most a hell lot later then in the old days that's for sure. Look at all those sissies and pussies. They can't just commit tradditionnal suicide if they want, they have to take 10 more people with them. And that's what we call an "Attention Wh0re".


In my oppinion we'd need WW3 to build a solid character in all those low-lifes. Send them to war, without their marilon manson cd, but a good ----ing book. What percentage of kids read books on their own today, not school imposed stuff. 0.0001%? Technology is great, but we'r starting to drown in it, becomming softer and wimpier everyday as a society.


And as I say, Society Sucks.

[Nick]

I blame the ----ing kids...come on guys, some time people just have to be held accountable for their actions.

QFT

fillerfillerfiller

[anhedonia]

Well, I guess it all depends on nature vs. nurture. Are people the way they are because that is just who they are (is that just their nature?) or are the way they are because of the way they have been brought up, etc? And there just isn't a definitive answer to that theory, really.

I think the closest is this: if you are a decent person by nature, but are dealt a ---- hand, get abused constantly, have a terrible upbringing, etc, etc, perhaps that will influence you to become negative, bitter and change your decent nature to that of an indecent nature? And vice versa - if you are not the nicest person, but you are constantly shown niceness, decency, etc, throughout your childhood, will you then be influenced to become a nicer person?

Of course, theology can also come into it, if you want to get heavily into the debate.

[Jan]

Toefur, I agree with you. Parents aren't always responsible for everything. Obviously the blame lies with them some of the time, but just as often, it does not.
Parents/grandparents/adults in general who leave guns around the house where kids live/visit are to blame. If you must own a gun, lock the darned thing away!!!!!!! :devious2:

[Webdude]

Parents/grandparents/adults in general who leave guns around the house where kids live/visit are to blame. If you must own a gun, lock the darned thing away!!!!!!! :devious2:

I have loaded guns on the walls. My kids dont touch them. They used to want to though, so I trained them on them and how to be safe with them. Then later I had to take a mean dog to the woods and put it down. I asked if they wanted to go and they were jumping with joy.

They werent so happy when they saw the real thing. They were sick at their stomach and felt terrible for the animal. They realized then the difference between tv and real life. They havent bothered me about the guns since then, and that was several years ago.

If you are gonna have guns, make sure your kids respect them and not think of them as "grownup toys". That is exactly what I did. If you cant handle or dont want such a responsibility, you shouldnt have a gun. I'll bet that in all the school shootings, thats the firt time they have fired a gun other than maybe at some bottles (if that), and definitly the first time they ever killed anything. Because they arent raised properly with guns, then in the heat of a moment they grab a gun and go shooting at school. I have already nipped that in the bud with my kids. This might sound strange, but there's a difference between knowing what a gun can do, and KNOWING what a gun can do.

It's like drunk driving. Sometimes no matter what you show or teach a kid, they still end up driving drunk. They dont truly "get" it until they actually kill someone. Same with guns. In a safe environment, I let my kids see the real thing. It made a world of difference. They became totally different kids after seeing that.

It would never happen, but if classes of kids could be taken out and shown the exact same thing my kids saw, it would stop a lot of these problems with school shootings before they happen. Animal rights activists would be all over it, as would lawyers and lawmakers, and even the shrinks would have their useless say in all of it.

[notnamed]

Webdude, that works for well-adjusted kids when they're young, but for the ones ----ed up in the head, especially older ones, that'd just spur them on. Oooh, cool, look what it does, it's even better than TV.

[cococomics]

Kids these days are just way too selfish, always thinking about themselves.. i would have though 9/11, Bali, the Tsunami and so on, would of atleast had one positive outcome, opening up the the eyes of people who only think of themselves, let them realise the world is much bigger than one individual.

Like when you see people getting depressed over losing a girlfriend or boyfriend, or getting a bad mark at school that really ----s me. In the whole grand scheme of things, it means nothing. Bring back the cane in schools, and the right for parents to smack kids I say, kids need to learn respect again. And respecting elders too.
Yes! Someone out there agrees with me! I really couldn't add anything to this
/\ . Thank you!

[Wojtek]

Webdude, that works for well-adjusted kids when they're young
and we're getting back at the parenting issue

see, webdude did his job well, and it payed out
every kid is young at some point or the other, so every parent has a chance

[niv]

Well, it also matters if the kid is a dumbass or not...and that I didn't address. There are just some kids that are way too stubborn to accept rational rules.

[Jan]

The first time I ever saw a gun was on American TV, go figure ;)

[anhedonia]

hehe, I love that you specifically said American TV :p

[trenzterra]

I hate it when kids start blaming video games for their own problem, and then consequently the game manufacturer gets into trouble.

i.e. GTA series

[Robert]

The first time I ever saw a gun was on American TV, go figure ;)
Was that in America? Or on a TV made in America? Otherwise, it was an Assuie TV http://freewebspace.net/forums/images/new/wink.gif

[Daniel]

Kids these days are just way too selfish, always thinking about themselves.. i would have though 9/11, Bali, the Tsunami and so on, would of atleast had one positive outcome, opening up the the eyes of people who only think of themselves, let them realise the world is much bigger than one individual.

Like when you see people getting depressed over losing a girlfriend or boyfriend, or getting a bad mark at school that really ----s me. In the whole grand scheme of things, it means nothing. Bring back the cane in schools, and the right for parents to smack kids I say, kids need to learn respect again. And respecting elders too.

It's not that kids don't have respect, it's that they never had it in the first place. This kid who did the shooting, was a minority, had no father or mother, had grandparents that were most likely assholes, went to a bad school, and was constantly ridiculed at school. It makes you feel like ----. Some people just snap. A human can only take so much.

[Jan]

It still comes down to the fact that if guns weren't so freely available in the USA, then a lot of these tragedies wouldn't occur. And if those who felt they [i[must[/i] have a gun in the house, secured it so kids didn't have easy access to it. I wonder if the parents/grandparents feel proud that "my little Johnny" decked 20 people today :S

[rhianna]

It still comes down to the fact that if guns weren't so freely available in the USA, then a lot of these tragedies wouldn't occur. And if those who felt they [i[must[/i] have a gun in the house, secured it so kids didn't have easy access to it. I wonder if the parents/grandparents feel proud that "my little Johnny" decked 20 people today :S

Jan, what about normal people who grew up in households with guns?
There are families (who had/have normal children ) where hunting and skeet shooting has been a tradition.

My cousin (in his 30s) has a gun collection. He loves guns and he is a very responsible citizen. Not every gun owner is a total wacko.

Would you restrict responsible gun ownership?

[Robert]

It still comes down to the fact that if guns weren't so freely available in the USA, then a lot of these tragedies wouldn't occur. And if those who felt they [i[must[/i] have a gun in the house, secured it so kids didn't have easy access to it. I wonder if the parents/grandparents feel proud that "my little Johnny" decked 20 people today :S I don't understan why you keep saying the USA. This shooting is the first in a while. It's not like there are tons of school shootings. If you look at other countries, there are children carring automatic AK-47's in the streets. The U.S. is nothing compared to these other countries. You make it sound like it's the U.S. that allows children "free access" to guns and that nobody in the U.S. cares about the safety of children and that everyone is walking around with Guns. The 2nd Amendment allows U.S. Citizens to the right of bear arms, so they are entitled to have a gun in their home. It's not "freely available", but the whole purpose of a gun is for protection. If you, as aparent, hide your gun with a lock in a safe that requires an access code which is bolted to the floor in your closet under a blanket.. what purpose does it serve if someone breaks into your home? You won't have time to access the gun.

[Webdude]

It still comes down to the fact that if guns weren't so freely available in the USA, then a lot of these tragedies wouldn't occur. And if those who felt they [i[must[/i] have a gun in the house, secured it so kids didn't have easy access to it. I wonder if the parents/grandparents feel proud that "my little Johnny" decked 20 people today :S

If beer wasnt so freely available, there would be a lot less trajedies.
If cars werent so freely available...
If stairs werent so freely available...
If swimming polls werent so freely available..
If insect chemicals werent so freely available...
If [insert here] wasnt so freely available...

Get my drift? The comment "if guns werent so freely available" is a mute point. They are here just like everything else, and they arent going anywhere. Thus, what we have to do is keep them out of the hands of criminals and idiots. If the government tried to outlaw them it would amount to nothing less than a civil war..... which is why they havent attempted it. It's a simple fact that the general population of the U.S. has more guns than the U.S. military..

Another thing is statistics. Yes there are a lot of gun deaths in the U.S. compared to other countries, but if you compare point to point, it's not that much. Equalize the population of the United States to another country. Then equalize the number of both the populations the % that own guns. Now take those numbers and compare the death percentage by guns and you will find the U.S. has the lower average. For example. If you have a population of 1000, and 10 of those have guns, and one of those people kill another in cold blood, you just beat the U.S. national average. I used the small numbers for simplicity, but it explains the math.

[aaditya]

I wud like to have such free laws regarding weapons in india.

I long for a sniper rifle.

[notnamed]

Sniper rifles aren't handguns, they're sniper rifles. I'm sure it's just as hard to get one in the US as it is in India. You don't just walk into Walmart and buy a sniper rifle.

[bozley05]

Haha, that cracks me up everytime... Walk into Walmart and buy a gun..

[jmiller]

Here, in Canada you can't even buy airgun pellets at WalMart without having your ID checked and them okaying the sale.

[niv]

Well, at least somewhere regulations are being followed... :rolleyes:

[Webdude]

Sniper rifles aren't handguns, they're sniper rifles. I'm sure it's just as hard to get one in the US as it is in India. You don't just walk into Walmart and buy a sniper rifle.

Nope, you can get those too. They are just more expensive. With certain licenses, you can get fully automatic weapons like AK-47. Sniper rifles are really nothing more than high powered guns with high powered scope lined up correctly. You can turn a .22 long-rifle into a sniper..

[Renegade]

You killed a dog webdude? Curse you!

[tandoc]

I think he had to put it down, like that book. Old yellow or something. I read it ages ago, and forgot the title...

[notnamed]

Nope, you can get those too. They are just more expensive. With certain licenses...
That's my point. But you don't just walk into Walmart and buy a .22 and a sniper scope.

[Daniel]

Since I went to Texas this summer and shot some guns that belong to a friend a mine(they didn't register ANY of the guns, btw). Includes a Walther P28, a 1911, some .22 bolt-action rifle, an semi-automatic AK47, and an M1 Garand. I can definitely tell you, even though I'm a pretty bad shot, it was EXTREMELY fun. Shooting targets and skeet shooting is quite possibly the funnest thing I've ever done. Personally, if it was possible, I'd purchase a gun in Canada for target shooting. It's an actual hobby.



That's my point. But you don't just walk into Walmart and buy a .22 and a sniper scope.
To purchase a gun, you need a license regardless. But it isn't hard to acquire one. Fill out a form and send in some money, you get a gun license and you can purchase a .22 and a scope.

[Robert]

Since I went to Texas this summer and shot some guns that belong to a friend a mine(they didn't register ANY of the guns, btw). Includes a Walther P28, a 1911, some .22 bolt-action rifle, an semi-automatic AK47, and an M1 Garand. I can definitely tell you, even though I'm a pretty bad shot, it was EXTREMELY fun. Shooting targets and skeet shooting is quite possibly the funnest thing I've ever done. Personally, if it was possible, I'd purchase a gun in Canada for target shooting. It's an actual hobby.

Then the guns are stolen if they aren't register. The gun becomes registered when you make the purchase and you fill out the registration form, it's submitted to the State.

[jmiller]

How are they stolen just because they aren't registered?

[Robert]

How are they stolen just because they aren't registered?
You cannot purchase a gun w/o it being registered. A gun isn't a TV where you get a "registration card" in the package and you are to fill it out and send it in. When you make a gun purchase, it's registered w/ the State in your name. Most places now require you to have a gun license to even purchase the gun, furthermore, they hold it for 3-5 days before releasing it to you. I enjoy purchasing old guns, such as guns used during the Nazi era and other times, which of course don't require registration. I recently bought a Desert Eagle, which hasn't arrived yet.

[jmiller]

god, that was condescending.

And from what I have been reading, it isn't considered "stolen" just because it isn't registered. Although it is still highly illegal.

[Webdude]

That's my point. But you don't just walk into Walmart and buy a .22 and a sniper scope.

I dont know, they have some pretty powerful scopes in there. It wouldnt be hard to mount one of these http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=2653075 on a gun, goto a shooting range and aim it out.

Come to think of it, mebbe I will do just that. Hell I got the guns, and that scope is only $60 :P

http://myschooltalk.com/snake/tank2.jpg I took this of my snake tank, but it shows one of mine by the door. That one is usually used for shooting rabbits to feed my dogs. It's probably got one of the smallest scopes walmart sells. Oh yeah, and got my slingshot there for pelting strays that come in my yard :D

Other than that, I dont have pics of any of my other rifles, which are in my garage, which is in my back yard, which is fenced in with a 6ft chain link, which is full of German Sheperds. So I'm not too worried about them getting stolen... at least not before I get out there with my 22 rifle or a pistol :P

Oh, and none of mine are registered either. You arent required to do so here. Doesnt do much. Cops cant verify it either way if the serial is grinded off, which is what the bad guys do in states where registration is required. If they cant verify it's not registered, they cant get you.

Better yet, mount this baby to your rifle :D
http://i.walmart.com/i/p/00/02/97/57/78/0002975778886_500X500.jpg