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Netscape vs Explorer

Originally posted by Dry Ice CO2
Okay all you Microsoft haters, listen up!

Why the hell are you dissing them up? Think about it for a second. Is there any reason you have other than the fact that they're a big company with lots of money? If that's your reason to hate a company, then can I feel free to stab you to death if you become a multi millionaire business owner?

I agree....MS hating is most often for no other reason than their success.

Admit it, Microsoft makes some pretty good stuff. And Internet Explorer is one of their best brainchilds. Netscape is horrible compared to IE. Did you know that NSN doesn't even support background colors for tables? Did you know that NSN 4.x doesn't support CSS? Did you know that NSN is owned by AOL???

They do, and IE has been great for the web...I wouldn't say netscape 4 is horrible in comparison, tho, it was a good browser when it came out....unfortunately, its not almost 2 generations behind. NS4 does support CSS. Just not fully.

Now I'm not dissing AOL's company size, I have other reasons. For example, their software is extremely overbulked, but you NEED to install it to use AOL! With other Dialup ISPs, you just make a new connection in Dial Up Networking, enter in a username and password, and you've got the internet. Also, the people in the chat rooms consist of white trash 14 year old sluts with names like "Candy SeXXXy 69", pedophiles/stalkers, idiots, narcs, people who overuse the abbreviation "A/S/L", and people with more numbers than letters in their numerated usernames because the username "Bob" was already taken. That's why I hate AOL.

I have two differing thoughts on AOL. First, to be fair, they have expanded the reach of the internet and made it more accessble to the idiots. Job well done, mission accomplished. However....do they HAVE to screw their customers? For $23.95 (canadian), you get an ISP with lots of busy signals, jackasses for customer service, Pop-up ads and bloated software....Man, you'd think the world's biggest ISP would at lease be competitive...for 19.95, I can get Sympatico, which is faster, cheaper and with no bloatware....that's why I hate AOL....

Getting back on topic, let me tell you about NSN 6. It's basically NSN 4.x with CSS support added, skin support added, and blinking text support removed. The skins look stupid, and if you want some stupid skins that lag your surfing even further, just use NeoPlanet (which borrows most of it's features from your installed version of Internet Explorer)

No, NS6 is a complete rewrite from NS4. Its based on Mozilla's Gecko engine, not NS4. Its also one of the most HTML compliant browsers out there, much ahead of IE's lacksidasical HTML requirements...

Yes, I understand Microsoft messed up in terms of security holes and OS exploits (which they try to make up for with service packs), but the topic of this thread is "Netscape vs Explorer", not "Windows vs Linux".

When will you Netscape lovers learn?

This isn't just about Netscape lovers. There are some legitament reasons to still use NS4 (NS6 is still to buggy for real use). First, I still prefer the Netscape GUI over IE (I use IE, however). Its also more strict with coding conventions that IE is, which, while being a pain to get cross compatibility, is actually a good thing. If IE dumbs down the standards too much, you won't be able to find an error free page anywhere, which is definitely not a good thing for any new browsers or users of older browsers....
 
I agree....MS hating is most often for no other reason than their success.

Glad to see that someone sees my point on that.

They do, and IE has been great for the web...I wouldn't say netscape 4 is horrible in comparison, tho, it was a good browser when it came out....unfortunately, its not almost 2 generations behind. NS4 does support CSS. Just not fully.

Yeah, but NSN 4.x and IE 4.x were released around roughly the same time, and even IE 4.x conquers over NSN 4.x

As for CSS, Netscape was very lazy and blind when it comes to that issue. Many webmasters view CSS as the future of the web, and for Netscape to do a half assed job on implementing it, that's just lame.

I have two differing thoughts on AOL. First, to be fair, they have expanded the reach of the internet and made it more accessble to the idiots. Job well done, mission accomplished. However....do they HAVE to screw their customers? For $23.95 (canadian), you get an ISP with lots of busy signals, jackasses for customer service, Pop-up ads and bloated software....Man, you'd think the world's biggest ISP would at lease be competitive...for 19.95, I can get Sympatico, which is faster, cheaper and with no bloatware....that's why I hate AOL....

More accessible to the idiots? Well there's no arguing that, seeing as AOL was my first ISP ever, and I can honestly look back on those days and say "My God, I was an idiot back then compared to now!"

As for Sympatico... are you, by any chance, living in Southern Ontario, specifically the GTA and surrounding regions? If so, I live near you (in Markham)! Right now I'm using Rogers @Home Cable Internet, which gets slower and slower every day. The connection speed is insulting, and they just raised their prices and updated their ToS agreement to say that you can't use a router to split your connection across other computers. Things were much better with Shaw... *sigh*. Now if you want to know an evil company, Rogers is the one!

We're going to do the switch over to Bell Sympatico Highspeed Edition DSL Internet next week. The tech people at Sympatico say they don't care if we split our connection, and I think I know why. With cable TV, you're not legally permitted to use signal splitters unless you pay for a connection for each TV on the splitter (like buying more licences for software). With a telephone, you can hook as many phones as you want on your phone line, as long as you have lots of phone jacks to support them all. Also, cable internet is a shared connection, meaning that the more computers you have linked to it would result in bandwidth rape for other customers. With DSL, your bandwidth is yours alone, so you can do what you like with it.

But enough about my life...

No, NS6 is a complete rewrite from NS4. Its based on Mozilla's Gecko engine, not NS4. Its also one of the most HTML compliant browsers out there, much ahead of IE's lacksidasical HTML requirements...

Oops, just checked Mozilla.org, my mistake.

This isn't just about Netscape lovers. There are some legitament reasons to still use NS4 (NS6 is still to buggy for real use). First, I still prefer the Netscape GUI over IE (I use IE, however). Its also more strict with coding conventions that IE is, which, while being a pain to get cross compatibility, is actually a good thing. If IE dumbs down the standards too much, you won't be able to find an error free page anywhere, which is definitely not a good thing for any new browsers or users of older browsers....

I kind of agree with that. The NSN GUI looks more "professional", and IE (as well as many other Microsoft products) are leaning more towards looking more "Macintosh style" (WindowsXP is a prime example.) I also agree that IE is encouraging sloppy webmasters to rely on IE to fix their mistakes for them, and I think that should be dropped too.

Did you know ICQ is owned by AOL?

I only use ICQ to find my victims for DDoS attacks. And I only do that to people that spam me on ICQ. I have an unhealthy hatred for spammers, and I consider myself an anti-spam activist.

- Dry Ice CO2
 
Last edited:
Originally posted by Dry Ice CO2
I kind of agree with that. The NSN GUI looks more "professional", and IE (as well as many other Microsoft products) are leaning more towards looking more "Macintosh style" (WindowsXP is a prime example.) I also agree that IE is encouraging sloppy webmasters to rely on IE to fix their mistakes for them, and I think that should be dropped too.

There's a difference between elegant (MacOS X Aqua interface) and childish Windows XP interface.

I only use ICQ to find my victims for DDoS attacks. And I only do that to people that spam me on ICQ. I have an unhealthy hatred for spammers, and I consider myself an anti-spam activist.

My point was not that you use ICQ -- rather that AOL owns it and hasn't totally re-tooled the company like you suggest AOL does with the companies it aquires (such as Netscape).

-mk
 
Originally posted by Dry Ice CO2

Yeah, but NSN 4.x and IE 4.x were released around roughly the same time, and even IE 4.x conquers over NSN 4.x

As for CSS, Netscape was very lazy and blind when it comes to that issue. Many webmasters view CSS as the future of the web, and for Netscape to do a half assed job on implementing it, that's just lame.

Actually, I didn't start using IE until version 5....IE 4 just didn't do it for me.

Not sure about CSS...since I never used IE4, I don't know how much CSS it supports. As for them doing a half-assed job, well, that's true, however, it was very new technology back when NS4 was new...not yet a standard. So even partial implemenation at the time was not bad. The problem was that the NS4 engine was so poorly written, it made it difficult to add proper CSS support. Hence the complete rewrite.

More accessible to the idiots? Well there's no arguing that, seeing as AOL was my first ISP ever, and I can honestly look back on those days and say "My God, I was an idiot back then compared to now!"

As for Sympatico... are you, by any chance, living in Southern Ontario, specifically the GTA and surrounding regions? If so, I live near you (in Markham)! Right now I'm using Rogers @Home Cable Internet, which gets slower and slower every day. The connection speed is insulting, and they just raised their prices and updated their ToS agreement to say that you can't use a router to split your connection across other computers. Things were much better with Shaw... *sigh*. Now if you want to know an evil company, Rogers is the one!

We're going to do the switch over to Bell Sympatico Highspeed Edition DSL Internet next week. The tech people at Sympatico say they don't care if we split our connection, and I think I know why. With cable TV, you're not legally permitted to use signal splitters unless you pay for a connection for each TV on the splitter (like buying more licences for software). With a telephone, you can hook as many phones as you want on your phone line, as long as you have lots of phone jacks to support them all. Also, cable internet is a shared connection, meaning that the more computers you have linked to it would result in bandwidth rape for other customers. With DSL, your bandwidth is yours alone, so you can do what you like with it.

But enough about my life...

Yea, I am. I'm in etobicoke....I have Rogers@home too, and while the speed hasn't bothered me very often, I've got other issues with it, such as a few months ago when my connection went down every other day. Seems to be not bad now tho.

What are you paying out there? Its $39.95 here....haven't heard anything bout a price increase here...

They added that to the ToS, eh? Oh well....I'm running 3 computers and a server off there, and they haven't said anything to me now. ---- them. Back when my connection was really unstable, I looked in to DSL...not avaliable in my area....plus, at the bell stores, I noticed a speed drop from my cable...of course, being up all the time would have been advantageous ;)

I kind of agree with that. The NSN GUI looks more "professional", and IE (as well as many other Microsoft products) are leaning more towards looking more "Macintosh style" (WindowsXP is a prime example.) I also agree that IE is encouraging sloppy webmasters to rely on IE to fix their mistakes for them, and I think that should be dropped too.

Oops..that's a mistake...don't even compare MacOS to Windows, or you'll have the Maccies at your door in seconds....Personally, I think the MacOS GUI looks like a lollypop, and the WinXP GUI looks like a no-name cheap lollypop. Either way, I'm happy with Windows 2000 for a while.
 
Interesting thoughts...

I think some microshit products are nice word/IE however my major complaints against microsoft are the way it tries to control and manipulate things such as frontpage writing shitty code that won't run on any old server and ties you to their products. plus the state of the html itself - almost as good as that which word produces. They don't belive in slick functional

Also this increasing need to bulk up everything so that everyone needs to buy a new pc (plus OS) every couple of years.

Also why do linux servers run for years at a time whilst windows wants to be rebooted several times a day when it locks up? And why can't they just get one stable version working instead of all these different flavours with their unique f**k ups -

I think I'm just angry because I can't change the blue screen of death settings to a different colour - now that's the sort of thing they should be working on - :p

I don't hate them cos their big but because they try to remove my/your power. by not providing the information you need or allowing you to change things you should - bring back the command line I say.
 
Originally posted by lucifer
Interesting thoughts...

I think some microshit products are nice word/IE however my major complaints against microsoft are the way it tries to control and manipulate things such as frontpage writing shitty code that won't run on any old server and ties you to their products. plus the state of the html itself - almost as good as that which word produces. They don't belive in slick functional

Also this increasing need to bulk up everything so that everyone needs to buy a new pc (plus OS) every couple of years.

Also why do linux servers run for years at a time whilst windows wants to be rebooted several times a day when it locks up? And why can't they just get one stable version working instead of all these different flavours with their unique f**k ups -

I think I'm just angry because I can't change the blue screen of death settings to a different colour - now that's the sort of thing they should be working on - :p

I don't hate them cos their big but because they try to remove my/your power. by not providing the information you need or allowing you to change things you should - bring back the command line I say.

Before you talk about Windows crashing all the time, you should get ahold of a copy of windows 2000. I installed it back in september, and I haven't rebooted froma crash once. The only time I ever reboot is when I get some software that requires it, or when I apply a service pack.
 
I will agree that IE allows for sloppy coding.

I don't believe Netscape will be any better than IE as long as Microsoft is still doing business today.

Most users like the user friendly environment of Microsoft and all of its products.

Other companies haven't come out with anything better so why even argue the matter that any other product other than Microsoft is better.

Till other companies can gain ground on making better user friendly OS and other software products I don't believe IE / Word / Excel or any other of MS products will be taken out of the lead.

This is the whole reason why Linux OS isn't as popular as Microsoft OS.

As long as we have users that are not Programmers / or Techies that can code or configure the software then Microsoft will always be the popular source of computer software.

By all means give me your view on this...

:rolleyes:

P.S. Not all websites are developed by Professional Web developers .... So Microsoft usually becomes the first choice when designing sites.

HGW .... Homey says so.....

:D
 
Quit the zealotry

Just use what you want and shut up. No need to cram it down everyone's throat.

You guys really act like kids being denied candy at the store.

Opinions are a stupid thing to fight over.
 
Who's fighting? Its been pretty civilized to this point, I'd say. Nothing wrong someone explaining the logic behind his/her differing opinion...
 
I didn't say anyone was.

But the fact that this topic is 4 pages long with every other post full of those annoying as hell quotes with people saying that their opinions are more correct then someone else's remains.

Maybe if these people got lives they could find real things to debate over.
 
Hey Hellbound,

Isn't that the purpose of this website is to promote discussion on topics?

We are all just giving our opinions and explaining why we believe one product is better than the other.

I personally don't care if anyone else agrees with me.

Its just fun to get different views from different people.

This is what the the World Wide Web is about. Sharing info and ideas with various people.

So why you have a problem with that?

HGW --- lighten up dude...:)

Want a good quote "Opinions are like -------s everyone has one.";)
 
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