The Sars thread

[The Red Guy]

Scientists suspect that it originates from animals, and farmers in close contact with animals (Guangdong) makes the place a breeding place for viruses.

 

[Jan]

Yeah yesterday they thought they had isolated it to bird breeders, but they are still no closer I think. Time will tell. :confused2

 

[The Red Guy]

On the news now, doctor gets, and he is suspected of spreading to two wards. Now 4 hospitals have sars patients... not enough hospitals anymore!!!

 

[conkermaniac]

Originally posted by tandoc
more people die from AIDS, Flu, and other things than sars.. a lot of reported cases have also recovered

if this was mentioned earlier i didn't notice, i didn't want to read those long posts :biggrin2:

Yep, I mentioned it. Actually, not many people die from the common flu, but when there's an epidemic, it's severe. Sometimes, it can cause Ebola-like symptoms (frequent hemorrhages, and extremely high fever), and because it mutates so quickly, it has the potential of being even worse than Ebola (which, I would like to remind you guys, has an 80-90% fatality rate). So the flu is potentially more dangerous -- thankfully, we don't have flu epidemics every few years.

 

[allanh]

Originally posted by conkermaniac
There are some treatments for SARS now -- there are no treatments for the flu. The virus is capable of morphing in a matter of weeks, and nobody would be stupid enough to develop a treatment that would only work for a couple of weeks. In any case, there are vaccines for the flu, but they are not very effective. In the only year that I got a flu shot, I contracted the flu. That's why I don't bother getting them anymore.



SARS primarily kills the sickly people. The mortality rate of SARS is actually around 3-4%, and medical experts around the world say that it really can't be more than 5%. A greater percentage of people die from plain pneumonia, which is a bacterium that can be treated with antibiotics. There are just as many people who have fully recovered from SARS as people who have died, and many others who are almost fully recovered. In Hong Kong, where almost an entire apartment block (around 200 something people) contracted SARS, nobody has died the last time I checked.

When you dismiss the flu as a harmless virus, you are thinking about the common strand that everyone gets from time to time. I'm talking about the flu epidemics that kill tens of millions of people in just a year. At the current rate, SARS is going to kill at most 300 people this year (although I seriously doubt that the figure is going to be more than 100).

You seriously have to be kidding me when you say that SARS is potentially more contagious than the flu...Someone from the WHO came on CNN yesterday saying that "fortunately the disease is not as contagious as the flu". It's been known for quite a while that the disease is not as serious as the media makes it out to be. What is your source?

1.There is NOT TREATMENT for SARS at present. All the treatment that you may have heard of are purely symptomatic (oxygen, ventilator, pain relief, bronchodilator, adrenaline if in respiratory failure)

2.Current Fluvax covers about most of thewell known strands of influenza virus. Therefore, if you have it once/year, it should have you covered. (70% of of all influenza strands will be covered, the other 30% are much rarer)

3.SARS kills both sick AND healthy people. That's why it's a much deadlier condition than normal influenza. The mortality rate of influenz is practically zero among normal population. SARS has an overall mortality of 5% ( which includes HEALTHY people)

4.More people die from pneumonia because the patients who contracted pneumonia are predominantly made up of ELDERLY patients who are immunodeficient. Nearly 100% of immunocompetent patients recovers completely from pneumonia, if they get it in the first place (which is rare)
You can't just compare 2 different population groups and their mortality rates to each other

5.I never said SARS is more contagious than flu. I said it has the potential once it becomes an endemic disease.

6.AIDS is no longer considered as an 100% mortality disease. It is an outdated idea. Currently, HIV+ patients who have been treated with antiviral regimine early ( whilst their CD4 count is still high) has being shown to not develop AIDS for up to 10 years. Advances in medical treatment of HIV viral load and its complications has ensured that HIV becoming a chronic disease like cardiac failure.
Even when AIDS develops (ie CD4 < 400), as long as complications are properly controlled, patients normally sustain a normal way of living under proper antiviral drugs.
All you have to do is to look at Magic Johnson.
Of course, non-compliant patient still die from AIDS rather quickly.


7.My sources? Respiratory professor of The Royal Melbourne Hospital ( Prof Lou Erving, head of the respiratory department) and medical text book ( Harrison's 15th Edittion).

 

[conkermaniac]

Originally posted by allanh
1.There is NOT TREATMENT for SARS at present. All the treatment that you may have heard of are purely symptomatic (oxygen, ventilator, pain relief, bronchodilator, adrenaline if in respiratory failure)

Yeah, I admitted I could be wrong, but Wen Jiabao has announced that a treatment is in rapid development. I am confident that China, with more researchers than any other country, will be able to develop a working treatment soon, despite the pessimism of the WHO.

2.Current Fluvax covers about most of thewell known strands of influenza virus. Therefore, if you have it once/year, it should have you covered. (70% of of all influenza strands will be covered, the other 30% are much rarer)

Hmm...it doesn't seem to work very well, so I have stopped getting flu shots every year. Certainly they must change it from year to year! I can't imagine how they can manage to contain the flu with the same shot every year.

3.SARS kills both sick AND healthy people. That's why it's a much deadlier condition than normal influenza. The mortality rate of influenz is practically zero among normal population. SARS has an overall mortality of 5% ( which includes HEALTHY people)

Of course. Nobody asserted that common influenza kills other people. I did a report on this, and although I was unable to get reliable fatality rate stats, the figure is much less than 1% (hey, I can't remember -- it was 2 years ago!).

4.More people die from pneumonia because the patients who contracted pneumonia are predominantly made up of ELDERLY patients who are immunodeficient. Nearly 100% of immunocompetent patients recovers completely from pneumonia, if they get it in the first place (which is rare)
You can't just compare 2 different population groups and their mortality rates to each other

Frankly, neither of us can know for sure whether old or young people are dying from SARS. We know that it is capable of infecting perfectly healthy people, we don't know if it is capable of killing these people. There are entire apartment blocks where almost everybody has been infected yet no one has died. This leads me to suspect that the virus does not generally kill patients who are immunocompetent.

6.AIDS is no longer considered as an 100% mortality disease. It is an outdated idea. Currently, HIV+ patients who have been treated with antiviral regimine early ( whilst their CD4 count is still high) has being shown to not develop AIDS for up to 10 years. Advances in medical treatment of HIV viral load and its complications has ensured that HIV becoming a chronic disease like cardiac failure.
Even when AIDS develops (ie CD4 < 400), as long as complications are properly controlled, patients normally sustain a normal way of living under proper antiviral drugs.
All you have to do is to look at Magic Johnson.
Of course, non-compliant patient still die from AIDS rather quickly.

While you are right in saying that new AIDS treatments have significantly prolonged the life expectancy of AIDS patients with access to good medical facilities, no one has ever recovered from AIDS. Until that happens, the figure remains at 100%.

 

[allanh]

Originally posted by conkermaniac

While you are right in saying that new AIDS treatments have significantly prolonged the life expectancy of AIDS patients with access to good medical facilities, no one has ever recovered from AIDS. Until that happens, the figure remains at 100%.

hehe, for that matter, aging is the number one killer - 100% death rate

 

[The Red Guy]

There is no treatment available, they're only taking the immunity (those who recover develop an immunity they say, not sure of the scientific term ) and treat the serious patients. It's up to your immune system to fight the virus though.

 

[allanh]

Originally posted by The Red Guy
There is no treatment available, they're only taking the immunity (those who recover develop an immunity they say, not sure of the scientific term ) and treat the serious patients. It's up to your immune system to fight the virus though.

you are absolutely correct. That is exactly the current situation.

In fact, there is no treatment for common cold either. Except that SARS is 10x more lethal.

 

[The Red Guy]

Originally posted by allanh
you are absolutely correct. That is exactly the current situation.

In fact, there is no treatment for common cold either. Except that SARS is 10x more lethal.

Super contagious. Taiwan is quite isolated isn't it?

 

[conkermaniac]

Originally posted by The Red Guy
Super contagious. Taiwan is quite isolated isn't it?

Taiwan's not isolated! It would quickly become hell on earth if the US and China went to war. Look at Kerguelen Island in the Indian Ocean...now that's what I would call isolated.

 

[allanh]

ok, 103 deaths from SARS so far now. Only a few days ago, it was 50.

 

[Jan]

118 now, they think the worst is over now

 

[The Red Guy]

Bt in Hongkong there is another problem, the symntoms don't show in some and others don't even have coughing etc! How do they detect in these cases!? Impossible!

 

[conkermaniac]

There's only been 1 case in Shanghai, but people here are getting all paranoid about it.

I know for a fact that the situation is worse in Beijing and Hong Kong. I hear that it's really bad in Bangkok and Taipei as well.

Bt in Hongkong there is another problem, the symntoms don't show in some and others don't even have coughing etc! How do they detect in these cases!? Impossible!

Hmm...maybe they don't even have SARS! I remember that a while back, just about everybody who contracted any disease was reported to have SARS. They even said that my classmate, who had tonsilitis (tonsilitis, for God's sake!), had SARS. The whole situation really got out of hand.

 

[Jan]

conker, several people are hospitalised daily here with SARS like symptoms, whilst none are/were actually Sars victims, they take precautions (all had recently returned from Asia) , and those same precautions worldwide have almost halted this disease.

 

[conkermaniac]

Originally posted by Jan
conker, several people are hospitalised daily here with SARS like symptoms, whilst none are/were actually Sars victims, they take precautions (all had recently returned from Asia) , and those same precautions worldwide have almost halted this disease.

I know that they're taking precautions. But they shouldn't announce that someone has SARS when they really have tonsilitis.

 

[The Red Guy]

The worst hit are hospital staff - now people are afraid to face them.

 

[Jan]

133 now